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Date/Time: Sun, 07 Sep 2025 14:26:57 +0000



Prop firms moving away from Rithmic

View Count: 4134

[2024-11-10 01:42:01]
DayTraderEsad - Posts: 121
Yeah, copier just connected to NT8 or SC

Breakdown
Supports Sierra Chart, NT8
Copies trades between a source and destination
Copy trades Sierra Chart to Sierra Chart
Copy trades NT8 to NT8
Copy trades from Sierra Chart to NT8 (both directions)
Supports copying from a source to multiple destinations (and from multiple destinations to single or multiple destinations)
Symbol Mapping, Trades ES but copy to a Micro
Support all symbols, no matter that data you are using
Volume allocation/multiplier
Include/Exclude Symbols
[2024-11-10 01:44:54]
DayTraderEsad - Posts: 121
Added a image of what it looks like -- its a software that connects to other instances and nothing needs to be open at other instances, just connected to the other broker/prop.
imagecopier.png / V - Attached On 2024-11-10 01:43:43 UTC - Size: 63.06 KB - 275 views
Attachment Deleted.
imagecopier.png / V - Attached On 2024-11-10 01:44:50 UTC - Size: 63.06 KB - 207 views
[2024-11-10 04:36:21]
User743676 - Posts: 2
@ day trader esad how can we access your discord the link further up the message chain is saying invalid or expired
image26F35B09-8EA9-41E7-8D88-6671E3420A02.png / V - Attached On 2024-11-10 04:34:34 UTC - Size: 3.97 MB - 200 views
Attachment Deleted.
[2024-11-20 20:08:42]
User82995 - Posts: 19
Could also Join to the channel? I'm interested in the copier
[2025-08-10 11:59:00]
User710679 - Posts: 44
@DayTraderEsad I would be interested in your trade copier. Can you please send me some info about it? thanks
Date Time Of Last Edit: 2025-08-10 11:59:34
[2025-08-10 15:33:12]
User753428 - Posts: 181
I have had amazing experience with dxFeed data feeds. They do not provide execution, however. Being based in Asia, I cannot use Denali for realtime data - both Rithmic and CQG have been much better in this regard. By better I mean that data is coming in very fast, whereas Denali is very slow and skips prices.

It would be amazing to be able to use dxFeed for data and, for example, CQG for execution...

That is exactly what I meant. Not missing data for certain prices, but jumping to the final price. From reading the tape perspective, prices are skipped because I can't see how the market moved, just the end result. It makes trading my system impossible.

hey ivory, i noticed this too. when you're in asia, denali feed feels nothing like rithmic/cqg in terms of snappiness. both of us are using the same network connection when using denali vs rithmic/cqg so it's obviously not our network connection like sc team keeps accusing ppl of. like you said, it feels like denali is "jumping" to the final price like it's trying to not fall behind...as someone who also reads the tape, our way of trading is basically made impossible with denali in asia so i've been searching for alternative like you.


which platform are you using to view dxFeed, even if it's only for data? does it also support ultra-low chart update intervals like sierra? there are many good execution platforms so finding an alternative for order routing is no problem.
[2025-08-10 20:01:46]
Sierra_Chart Engineering - Posts: 20829
It is definitively the network connection:
so it's obviously not our network connection like sc team keeps accusing ppl of.
And you are also making reference to a post more than a year old. There could have been problems, at that time, due to Internet peering issues that no longer exist.

The behavior you describe is simply due to poor Internet connectivity between your location and the server. It is the result of packet loss. This is fact.

It does not matter what your immediate Internet connection is like. That is completely irrelevant.
The server is far away in the US Midwest, and there is degraded Internet connectivity between your location and the server. Inevitably there is going to be packet loss, which will result in delays and the stopping of the data feed even for brief periods of time. If you notice stopping of the data feed, you have packet loss.

You are in Japan and that user is in Thailand:
both of us are using the same network connection
You are in different locations.

We recommend trying the New Zealand server and see if that helps:
Sierra Chart Server Settings: CME Exchange Data Feed Server Address and Port Override (Global Settings >> Sierra Chart Server Settings >> General >> Special)
Sierra Chart Support - Engineering Level

Your definitive source for support. Other responses are from users. Try to keep your questions brief and to the point. Be aware of support policy:
https://www.sierrachart.com/index.php?l=PostingInformation.php#GeneralInformation

For the most reliable, advanced, and zero cost futures order routing, use the Teton service:
Sierra Chart Teton Futures Order Routing
Date Time Of Last Edit: 2025-08-10 20:03:48
[2025-08-11 06:22:01]
User753428 - Posts: 181
And you are also making reference to a post more than a year old. There could have been problems, at that time, due to Internet peering issues that no longer exist.

not a recent issue. was the case since denali first launched for asia users but was able to circumvent by using cqg for cme data. brought up the issue multiple times over the years to which your response was always the same.

It does not matter what your immediate Internet connection is like. That is completely irrelevant.
The server is far away in the US Midwest, and there is degraded Internet connectivity between your location and the server. Inevitably there is going to be packet loss, which will result in delays and the stopping of the data feed even for brief periods of time. If you notice stopping of the data feed, you have packet loss.

as east asian user, when using cqg/rithmic's singapore or tokyo servers for cme data, don't have this problem. we are simply reporting what we are seeing with our naked eyes on our screens in front of us. we would appreciate if you could explain why we don't have the same issue with cqg/rithmic singapore/tokyo cme data when all of them are equally constricted by the distance to the US Midwest.


You are in Japan and that user is in Thailand:
both of us are using the same network connection
You are in different locations.

you misunderstood. i was not saying that user and i have the identical network connection. i was saying that when we are trying out denali, and rithmic, and cqg, we are using the same network connection across all 3 feeds so since we're controlling for the network connection variable, we can rule out this variable as the cause since the issue only persists with denali and not rithmic/cqg despite using the same network connection across all 3 feeds. (and in ivory's case, it seems like he also had success with dxfeed).
[2025-08-11 06:33:20]
ivory - Posts: 97
hey ivory, i noticed this too. when you're in asia, denali feed feels nothing like rithmic/cqg in terms of snappiness. both of us are using the same network connection when using denali vs rithmic/cqg so it's obviously not our network connection like sc team keeps accusing ppl of. like you said, it feels like denali is "jumping" to the final price like it's trying to not fall behind...as someone who also reads the tape, our way of trading is basically made impossible with denali in asia so i've been searching for alternative like you.

Hi there,

Glad I am not the only one to see this. I would be more glad if it didn't happen ;) but at least it's not just me.

We recommend trying the New Zealand server and see if that helps:

That did help me with data bursts, so if you haven't tried it, I'd recommend you do. The real time data feed still does not feel as smooth and responsive as Rithmic / CQG / dxFeed, but it's much better than with the US server.

You are in Japan and that user is in Thailand

Pretty bad practice to disclose people's location. Nevertheless, I might be in Thailand now, but I have been to nearly all SEA countries over the last 3 years and the issue was present in all of them anyway. So with the additional report from Japan, I would be very careful before making strong statements like yours.

which platform are you using to view dxFeed, even if it's only for data? does it also support ultra-low chart update intervals like sierra? there are many good execution platforms so finding an alternative for order routing is no problem.

To be fair, and this is my personal opinion, everything sucks. So I wouldn't recommend any particular platform. We are at a point, where data / execution providers modernized their stacks, but trading platforms seem to be still catching up.

At this point I am interested in switching over to Asian Futures, but there are issues with access to Historical Data. In the past Denali offered Asian exchanges, but that hasn't been the case for a few years now. CQG offers only 30 days of Time and Sales data... and I haven't found anything else. It's possible to get the data and manually create scid files, but it's more of a hack than anything else. If you know about a provider that works with Sierra, I'd be happy to hear about it.

Again - personal opinion. I am not interested in arguing about this with anyone. If you think I'm wrong, fine, you are welcome to your own opinion.
[2025-08-11 14:46:42]
User753428 - Posts: 181
Glad I am not the only one to see this. I would be more glad if it didn't happen ;) but at least it's not just me.

oh yeah, if you've been following this issue, it's been obvious to anyone outside of the US. here's another datapoint: https://www.reddit.com/r/SierraChart/comments/1hvolqp/comment/mmnyt34/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button

talking about this issue in the supportboard here is like talking to a wall, LOL. i don't expect a solution, i just wish they'd let us non-US customers use CQG data for CME instead of engaging in anticompetitive behavior.

At this point I am interested in switching over to Asian Futures, but there are issues with access to Historical Data. In the past Denali offered Asian exchanges, but that hasn't been the case for a few years now. CQG offers only 30 days of Time and Sales data... and I haven't found anything else. It's possible to get the data and manually create scid files, but it's more of a hack than anything else. If you know about a provider that works with Sierra, I'd be happy to hear about it.

i believe that was barchart and not denali, whose service sierrachart used prior to ditching them once they launched their own feed (denali). if you need a provider that works with Sierra for asian futures, you're limited to only CQG, IQfeed, and interactive brokers, right? Rithmic doesn't provide Asian Futures data and i think the only APAC exchange that IQfeed has is the singapore exchange so that's probably out. And interactivebrokers doesn't provide true tick data. if you must use sierrachart, the only option is buying the tick data from CQG (expensive!) and stitching them into scid files but CQG data has a lot of errors from my experience so i guess it depends on how clean of a dataset you need.
[2025-08-11 16:04:13]
ivory - Posts: 97
i believe that was barchart and not denali, whose service sierrachart used prior to ditching them once they launched their own feed (denali). if you need a provider that works with Sierra for asian futures, you're limited to only CQG, IQfeed, and interactive brokers, right? Rithmic doesn't provide Asian Futures data and i think the only APAC exchange that IQfeed has is the singapore exchange so that's probably out. And interactivebrokers doesn't provide true tick data. if you must use sierrachart, the only option is buying the tick data from CQG (expensive!) and stitching them into scid files but CQG data has a lot of errors from my experience so i guess it depends on how clean of a dataset you need.

Yeah so if we are talking about buying data in bulk and manually converting to scid files, then there are other options. tickdatamarket.com is very reasonably priced. You can also get JPX data for pennies from JPX Data Factory (less than 2$ per month of tick by tick with best bid/ask, if I recall correctly). It's not convenient to get, but it's straight from the horse's mouth, so to speak. CQG is expensive, but wait till you ask Barchart for a quote ;) Also prices for CQG Data Factory and CQG Portara are very different, the latter being more affordable, but tickdatamarket.com is still more competitively priced.

if you must use sierrachar

That's the core question. Must I? I guess the answer will come with time.
[2025-08-21 21:17:15]
User262849 - Posts: 6
@Sierra_Chart Engineering

is the video from the link (https://videos.sierrachart.com/USMarketOpen_Denali_2024-08-05.wmv) from a user in asia?
[2025-08-30 21:30:22]
Shink22 - Posts: 7
@DayTraderEsad can you share the discord link again?
[2025-09-02 21:51:53]
User262849 - Posts: 6
@Sierra_Chart Engineering

just wanted to verify that the video from the link you provided was from a user in asia again? thank you
[2025-09-03 16:03:55]
Sierra_Chart Engineering - Posts: 20829
No it is a video that we made from the US Midwest.

We have been meaning to follow-up in this thread. Explaining Internet connectivity.

When data delivered using the TCP/IP protocol and sent over a long distance, inevitably the number of updates per second goes down. Still fast, but not as fast as potentially 50 times a second. It will be less. Maybe less than 10 times a second. For example, in New Zealand we do notice fewer number of updates per second, but there is no delay beyond the introduced latency due to the distance and there is no stopping of the data feed. It is very good.

We are not totally sure of the reason for the fewer updates per second but it just must have to do with the high latency between the two locations and the extra time for acknowledgments to get through to the sender/server.

If the data is delivered with UDP, we would expect probably faster updates per second but there will be data loss. This is why we would not use UDP.

And it also needs to be understood for every packet that is sent from our servers in the Midwest, each has to be acknowledged, by the user's computer through the operating system. If any those acknowledgment packets get lost, it results, and data retransmission resulting in delays or if there is enough retransmission going on, the data feed just stops for a period of time and that it eventually catches up all at once. The illusion is that something is wrong with the data feed. No it is not. It is simply the transmission control protocol, doing this.:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transmission_Control_Protocol

Acknowledgments (ACKs) are sent with a sequence number by the receiver of data to tell the sender that data has been received to the specified byte. ACKs do not imply that the data has been delivered to the application, they merely signify that it is now the receiver's responsibility to deliver the data.

Reliability is achieved by the sender detecting lost data and retransmitting it. TCP uses two primary techniques to identify loss. Retransmission timeout (RTO) and duplicate cumulative acknowledgments (DupAcks).

When a TCP segment is retransmitted, it retains the same sequence number as the original delivery attempt. This conflation of delivery and logical data ordering means that, when acknowledgment is received after a retransmission, the sender cannot tell whether the original transmission or the retransmission is being acknowledged, the so-called retransmission ambiguity.[38] TCP incurs complexity due to retransmission ambiguity.[39]


However, we are still not getting to the important point here.

If we put a server in Asia, it should not make any difference at all and should be completely unnecessary. And this is an actual fact. Whatever we are able to accomplish by having good connectivity between the the US Midwest, and a server in Asia, you should be able to accomplish as well.

And once again we are going to reaffirm, that the problem does relate to degraded Internet connectivity somewhere from with the user's computer, all the way to the server.

There is no problem with the Denali Exchange Data Feed. The updating is very fast, there is no data feed stopping and no unreasonable delays. There is always some amount of delay due to data processing. But these delays, will be under 100 milliseconds normally. Could be higher during big bursts of activity. If you have good Internet connectivity within North America, or in Europe, not all of Europe is going to be good, then the data feed will work very well for you.

We do not deny that some users may have a problem. But it is due to the Internet connectivity.

Anyway we are still not getting to the main point here.

If we put a server in Asia, to receive data, from the US Midwest, where the data originates out of, then all of the same potential problems that someone in Thailand would have, still exist. If we are delivering that data using the TCP protocol, all the potential problems, of lagging data, fewer updates per second, and data stopping still exist.

The difference is that, we could use a virtual circuit, providing dedicated bandwidth, or we would be using better quality Internet connectivity, the data centers will have or we could obtain (although not necessarily).

So the reason why a server in Asia could potentially help, is that we will have very reliable Internet connectivity as compared to a user, possibly, between the server in Asia and America. But inevitably it is not going to be perfect and it will have its problems at times.

You would be able to establish a more reliable connection, possibly but not necessarily, due to the shorter distance between this server in Asia , and your location in Asia. Where there is a much lower latency, for return packets

So this is why, a server closer to your location may help and likely would some users but not all. However, we have no plans to add servers closer to Asia anywhere outside of what we already have in NZ. We are just not going to do that. We have no physical presence in Asia, and we trust absolutely no one, with server Infrastructure other than ourselves. Just never going to happen. And we mean never.

However, all of the latency, and all of the distance between the data feed origin still exist. So all of the potential problems can and will exist, at times. And if we are able to, establish good connectivity, between Asia, and the Midwest United States, you can too. That is the point. It should not help for us to put an intermediary server in Asia. You should be able to establish a reliable direct connection.

If we can do that, and provide better connectivity then you can as well. However the high latency still exists. And there will be fewer updates per second.

So there is no need to rely on us. Improve your Internet connectivity between your location and the US midwest. No need to put any reliance on us whatsoever. Rather than complaining about your own Internet connectivity and expecting us for a solution. That is wrong.
Sierra Chart Support - Engineering Level

Your definitive source for support. Other responses are from users. Try to keep your questions brief and to the point. Be aware of support policy:
https://www.sierrachart.com/index.php?l=PostingInformation.php#GeneralInformation

For the most reliable, advanced, and zero cost futures order routing, use the Teton service:
Sierra Chart Teton Futures Order Routing
Date Time Of Last Edit: 2025-09-03 19:55:59
[2025-09-03 16:08:41]
User262849 - Posts: 6
@Sierra_Chart Engineering

Thank you for clarifying. I appreciate the follow-up.
[2025-09-05 03:27:10]
Sierra_Chart Engineering - Posts: 20829
Maybe we should never say never.

Our experience, with servers is that we should always purchase and own our servers, and have direct control over them. This is after two decades of experience.

One exception, is a particular data center operator in Germany who is very good. Their name is Hetzner. We do use one server through them.

We really do not know anyone in Asia but we did some searching and came across this provider providing dedicated servers, in a Tokyo data center:
https://www.dataplugs.com/en/company/japan-data-centers/at-tokyo-cc1/

Using their looking glass:
https://www.dataplugs.com/en/company/looking-glass/

There is 128 Millisecond consistent round trip latency, to our servers in Aurora Illinois. Our main distribution servers. Running a trace route, we can see, the connectivity goes through the subsea cables terminating in Seattle.

So we will get a server from them. Give us about 3 weeks to set this up and we will see how it works. We also see, they offer direct China Bandwidth. That is something we are very interested in and looked at years ago but never proceeded forward with that.

Looks like we will need a separate server for direct China bandwidth. So we will have the ability to deliver data reliably into China.

If this works well, this would be a good distribution point in Asia. But understand you are still not going to have updates as fast as you would, within North America and Europe. There will be fewer updates per second with real-time data. The data is still going over a TCP/IP connection.

Looks like they have good connectivity:
https://www.dataplugs.com/en/company/network/

However, we still maintain, this should not be necessary if you have good Internet connectivity to North America. And normally there should not be a reason why you should not be able to achieve that. But may be, it would just be expensive if you need for example a business grade connection.

All we are doing, is just simply using the public Internet, from this location in Tokyo to connect to North America. This is all.

We do acknowledge, for users in China there is a problem, and having direct China bandwidth is going to be helpful.
Sierra Chart Support - Engineering Level

Your definitive source for support. Other responses are from users. Try to keep your questions brief and to the point. Be aware of support policy:
https://www.sierrachart.com/index.php?l=PostingInformation.php#GeneralInformation

For the most reliable, advanced, and zero cost futures order routing, use the Teton service:
Sierra Chart Teton Futures Order Routing
Date Time Of Last Edit: 2025-09-05 03:38:30
[2025-09-05 14:23:11]
User262849 - Posts: 6
@Sierra_Chart Engineering

Looking forward to it, thank you for the detailed response.

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